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post #51 of 236 (permalink) Old 08-02-2017, 09:30
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I saw what you wrote. It was written in front of me. Write there it was.

I mentioned Toggle because it goes some way towards helping anybody who is concerned about keeping phone charges low.

If I'd wanted to challenge what you'd said as an invalid comparison, which it is, I'd have pointed out that postage involves the physical carrying of goods over land and sea and that the transport costs would dictate a cost differential. Those costs could be averaged out should the EU decided on a universal postal service akin to the one we have in the UK. Whereas routing mobile phone calls over networks that already exist incurs no extra cost to the owners of the infrastructure. However I didn't do that.
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post #52 of 236 (permalink) Old 08-02-2017, 09:41
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Tell me, do you pay the same to phone someone in the UK from Norwich as you do from Normandy using a BT or SFR landline? Do you pay the same to send a letter or parcel within the UK or France as you do to send a letter or parcel between the 2 countries?
In my experience the UK is MUCH cheaper for postage both inland and from the UK to France, postage in France is not a cheap option and there seem to be a lot of petty restrictions about how to package items for postage which are unheard of in the UK....... they seem to require an awful lot of things to be packaged in a cardboard box bought from.......

You guessed it, "La Poste" this they justify by saying that they do not have doorstep deliveries, but everything is delivered into the required Post Office box with the approved key so that the Postperson (in our case a sweet lady) can open the box and put parcels straight inside - that makes deliveries much easier, and presumably quicker than ringing a bell and waiting fora non-answer. But the cost is high......

As regards phone calls, our landline package (UK Telecom) gives us free calls to UK landlines and to French landlines AT A PRICE. Calls to mobiles either in France or the UK are expensive and calls to 0345 or 0800 UK numbers are NOT foc. That is just the package that we have (although we are looking at changing it but sadly we cannot get broadband via ADSL or anything other than satellite, so we tend to try to use What'sApp and Skype when we can...... But communications (like most things in France) are more expensive than in the UK as the idea of "competition" does not exist - monopolies rule the market and customer service is non-existent.

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Since you are so knowledgeable about what IS going to happen please explain why, as part of the Brexit negotiations, is it so impossible for the UK to remain in the 'no roaming costs' area, after all many EU citizens travel to the UK with their mobile phones too. And if we do not remain in that deal, then I am sure the vast majority IN the UK won't see it as the end of the world.
I totally agree that the cost of reintroduced roaming charges is not even a minor point - it wil be less significant than that for the vast majority of the UK population who rarely venture into Eurpe other than perhaps a week or two for a holiday sitting on a sandy beach, drinking English beers and consuming English food in English pubs and restaurants. In other words it's like Exmouth but with more sun and warmer water to play around in - not really the same as going to see "Europe".

Reintroduction may well affect people who use their phones/tablets/laptops etc for business use and I am sure many will look for alternative ways round the cost by e.g. buying local sim cards (if that is possible), perhaps through new businesses set up simply to allow people to do that with the minimum of hassle.

I don't think that I have ever said differently, roaming charges are very minor c/w general living expenses and many people are unlikely to even notice it (unless they leave data roaming switched on by accident and suddenly find their iPad has been charging them a fortune to update all of it's bits and pieces several times a day......).

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post #53 of 236 (permalink) Old 08-02-2017, 13:46
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.......the vast majority of the UK population who rarely venture into Eurpe other than perhaps a week or two for a holiday sitting on a sandy beach, drinking English beers and consuming English food in English pubs and restaurants.
I can get by with a 3 SIM, Fon and a range extender for my WiFi but if someone was to tell me that English beer, English pubs and English food might be at risk because of Brexit then I might have to reconsider my position.

Peter
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post #54 of 236 (permalink) Old 08-02-2017, 14:24
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Originally Posted by siggie View Post
Tell me, do you pay the same to phone someone in the UK from Norwich as you do from Normandy using a BT or SFR landline? Do you pay the same to send a letter or parcel within the UK or France as you do to send a letter or parcel between the 2 countries?

Since you are so knowledgeable about what IS going to happen please explain why, as part of the Brexit negotiations, is it so impossible for the UK to remain in the 'no roaming costs' area, after all many EU citizens travel to the UK with their mobile phones too. And if we do not remain in that deal, then I am sure the vast majority IN the UK won't see it as the end of the world.
The costs of landline calls to France and other places are pretty minimal now if your in a decent tariff. So yes there isn't much in it thanks again to us being in the single market telecom providers can easily set up such deals. Posting something is a daft comparison as already covered.

Why would UK mobile providers stay within. The eu legislated tariffs? They are desperate for them to be blocked? They will be able to discount all the rules of capping, and max charges which before the eu intervened we saw people getting bills of thousands of pounds for data roaming etc and some proper horror story rip offs.

The point is its just one more good piece of eu legislation we will no longer be able to take advantage of and of course you and everyone else will not miss any of it until it's too late. Everything from mobile rates to workers rights to manufacturing standards right down to protecting stuff like the Cornish Pasty that Boris was so keen to wave about. Knob (him not you)
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post #55 of 236 (permalink) Old 08-02-2017, 15:53
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A thought has occurred to me

I do not know how the Eu rules against roaming charges have been drafted, but if the local company providing the connection within the EU area are making the additional 'roaming' charges, are those charges not controlled by the EU rules, since the service is being provided within the EU?

If the local EU company does not charge the UK company, with whom the user has a contract, for 'roaming', then the UK government could prevent the UK company for levying an additional charge.

Thoughts?

Geoff
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post #56 of 236 (permalink) Old 08-02-2017, 16:52
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Wouldn't it be calls from numbers which are based in and being used within EU member countries which are capped? Outside the EU the UK would have no power to control what EU based carriers charged for calls. It couldn't be done without the agreement of all the member states and since I believe it might be considered a benefit of membership I expect the UK would have to buy their way in. Much like the single market and so on. No benefits without membership.
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post #57 of 236 (permalink) Old 08-02-2017, 17:46
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Yep to the EU benefiting calls.
We in France have had 'free' calls to 102 countries for years. No limits at all except mobiles (not usa).
So we have been able to 'sit' on the phone to any of these 102 countries as long as we like all for €34. a month.
That includes land line, Internet and TV.
I can't find anything close in UK.

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post #58 of 236 (permalink) Old 08-02-2017, 17:51
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nicholsong View Post
A thought has occurred to me

I do not know how the Eu rules against roaming charges have been drafted, but if the local company providing the connection within the EU area are making the additional 'roaming' charges, are those charges not controlled by the EU rules, since the service is being provided within the EU?

If the local EU company does not charge the UK company, with whom the user has a contract, for 'roaming', then the UK government could prevent the UK company for levying an additional charge.

Thoughts?

Geoff
I did post the EU regulation involved earlier and it makes appalling reading (unless you are an insomniac in need of sleep), but effectively the member countries of the EU are limited on what they can charge for inside the EU, but no limit exists for calls to or from outside the EU. There are specific points about close to the border calls where specific arrangements MAY be made.

But AFAIK the roaming charges are actually imposed by the host country i.e. where the phone is registered who are not allowed to charge more for calls inside the EU, as I said. That does NOT apply to calls outside the EU in any way. Therefore UK based phone companies can add whatever roaming charge they want to calls made by or to a UK registered phone while outside the UK and can charge the EU based countries more for calls made by phones registered in countries outside the UK - so for them it is a win-win answer and a recipe for increased profitability.

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post #59 of 236 (permalink) Old 08-02-2017, 17:55
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Ray, what is a 102 country please?
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post #60 of 236 (permalink) Old 08-02-2017, 18:12
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Originally Posted by erneboy View Post
Ray, what is a 102 country please?
Alan, please read the line..... had 'free' calls to 102 countries for years .......
I'm sure you don't really need me to explain???

Ray.
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