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Fiat Water Ingress - Fiat Solution

85K views 73 replies 22 participants last post by  1happy 
#1 ·
This information is published courtesy of Fiat UK (and thx to Swift for the fast information)

As dedicated Fiat professional teams in Italy and UK we are aware of some customer complaints regarding water ingress into the engine compartment which is causing concern. Although this is unsightly there is no adverse short or long term technical effect on the operation of the engine or associated components.

However, understanding our customers concerns, Fiat have developed a solution to this problem that addresses both the cause and effect.

For more information we kindly ask you to call our dedicated motorhome customer care centre from Monday 1st October on 00800 3428 1111 or 0039 0244412160.

We apologise for the delay in resolving this issue but this has been due to the time required for testing and approving the solution and having the necessary parts available in order to put this into effect.

We will ensure that every motorhome affected is completely rectified in order that you may continue to enjoy your Fiat motorhome experience.
 
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#27 ·
Brownhills

Brownhills have just been on the phone, they are going to do the sealant repair themselves, they want it in this Thursday. (but don't know about the Fiat engine cover fix and neither apparently do the other local Fiat dealer) THE MESSAGE IS NOT GETTING THROUGH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Barry
 
#28 ·
This is part of one e-mail that I have from Peugeot

Thank you for your response.

I can confirm the Technical info update used by Fiat is also the same as would
be used by Peugeot & Citroen. xxxx xxxxx xx xxxxx xxxxxxx has been advised of
this new Technical update regarding a new cover which is placed over the ABS
pump.

The dealer has already ordered the kit for re-seal and from this e-mail to me they have informed the dealer re new engine cover.The re-seal kit I was told involved some rubber seals,will have to see what they are when they do the repair/fix.
 
#29 ·
Thanks for the information regarding the Fiat water ingress problem. I have discussed with my local Fiat Dealer & Fiat and the understanding I have is that Fiat are aware of the problem but as yet do not have a fix, but I am assured it is being worked on. I am also informed that the dealers are aware and under warranty will use a silicon sealant as a temp repair. I was also told that once a fix has been found a recall for all effected vehicles will be made.

We shall see !!!!

Steve
 
#30 ·
Fiat solution!

Hi.
Can anyone tell me what the original announcement was all about :?:
Nothing seems to have changed :!:
Several phone calls later & no one knows anything new :!:
Except more waiting for a letter this time :!:
I wonder if Fiat are just buying time so less people "reject" or heaven forbid "start legal action!
Has anyone any positive news or is it still just "sealant"???????????????
1happy
 
#34 ·
Tribute_650 said:
I Notice that Fridgeman in Panel Van forum has had his scuttle changed has anyone else? My Fiat Dealer still knows nothing so I will now ring the above number Many Thanks
My van is at a FiART dealer in Lincoln at the moment having some work done to it like,radio not working and air con also,but got a phone call the other day to say they were going to fit a new scuttle as well while it`s there.To be honest,I haven`t got a lot of faith in the scuttle assembly and I think this will fail as well.Unless they change the lap of the joint around this system will always have problems.

steve
 
#37 ·
Re Fiat solution.

fridgeman Posted: Today - 07:53 pm
TOOK THE VAN TO OUR DEALER WHO INTURN TOOK IT TO SHERWOOD FIAT DEALER IN NOTTS SOMEWHERE,try lower case, apparently they only changed the one half,i will keep a eye on it,
Read thread and fridgeman says this later in the thread.
Question remains:-Has anyone had a proper fix, not just sealant? :roll:
1happy
 
#39 ·
Rung that help line and was told that Fiat are sending a recall to all the Fiat owners. I was read a pre-prepared speech on how the fault was not causing a problem with the rigerously tested in any environment engine ! I pointed out that the water was going on some unprotected relays and I had a fault that cleared when they dried out.... :x

They told me to ring my fiat dealer, which I did, who said they only had a recall on Ducato servo pipes icing up !!!! not another prob 8O but nothing on this water problem so I am to await the recall from Fiat, which may take some time as they seem to class it as "cosmetic"

Cheers P
 
#41 ·
Fiat solution!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

urbanracer said:
Still waiting :roll: For what :?: For when :?:For how :?:
Me too!
My Authorised garage still knows nothing and Fiat aren't saying anything,
Except telling me to wait for letter,like I haven't waited enough months already
Then we get a postal strike.
If I didn't know better I would say Fiat have organised that too....Except the strike seems to be working so I know they haven't anything to do with it.

So what was last Fridays statement (below) about???

This information is published courtesy of Fiat UK (and thx to Swift for the fast information)

As dedicated Fiat professional teams in Italy and UK we are aware of some customer complaints regarding water ingress into the engine compartment which is causing concern. Although this is unsightly there is no adverse short or long term technical effect on the operation of the engine or associated components.

However, understanding our customers concerns, Fiat have developed a solution to this problem that addresses both the cause and effect.

For more information we kindly ask you to call our dedicated motorhome customer care centre from Monday 1st October on 00800 3428 1111 or 0039 0244412160.

We apologise for the delay in resolving this issue but this has been due to the time required for testing and approving the solution and having the necessary parts available in order to put this into effect.

We will ensure that every motorhome affected is completely rectified in order that you may continue to enjoy your Fiat motorhome experience.

Anyone?
 
#43 ·
Re: Fiat ingess of water under bonnet

Broom said:
Just ordered new Auto Trail Cheyenne 696 have we done the right thing with this water ingrease
Hi, Broom, and welcome to MHF.

To answer your question, yes, I'm sure you have. But monitor these forums, and make sure that your dealer fits the fix (when it's proven to work :roll: ). If in doubt, take a bucket of water with you when you pick up the van, and chuck it on the windscreen - lift the bonnet, and observe :?

Gerald
 
#45 ·
Fiat solution!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I agree "that the X250 base vehicle is excellent, except for the ill designed scuttle"
Sadly what I find unforgivable is
1:- How the H**L did they allow this to happen? :evil:
2:- Why the H**L can't they come up with a fix? :evil:
3:- Will I want to buy another vehicle from a company that treats its existing customers this way? :roll:
I quote from another forum below

"Having worked on diesel engines from a single cylinder donkey pump up to a Rolls Royce V12 1000 HP Tank engine via Ford, Perkins, BMC and Volvo engines and as someone who has bought a new Peugeot based motorhome, I have every sympathy with the various postings.

Let me explain, the Peugeot cylinder head is aluminium, the injectors are a high grade steel. There is a plastic cover which is very close to the aluminium cylinder head. The design of this cover is such that it traps a pool of water approx 5 mm deep and the water cannot seem to drain away. When the engine is cold and it is raining, water pours onto the cover and can lie there for weeks as Motorhomes are often not used for some periods of time.

1st concern is that I believe that the rusting of the steel injectors and the associated corrosion of the aluminium head will be such that it may be problematic in removing the injectors. A further concern is the possibly of corrosion debris dropping into the engine once the copper gasket has been broken.

2nd There is a hole in the scuttle directly above the fuse box and I have watched water drain directly onto this area.

3rd Peugeot have track record of leaking vans, one of the previous versions of the present Boxer leaked water and this ended up causing both mechanical and electrical problems."
I rest my case why I have lost confidence
 
#46 ·
Corrosion or electrolosis between high grade steel and aluminium is a very big factor.
When Mercedes first launched the cdi diesel engine in the sprinter van they suffered the very problem that you refer to.
although they did not suffer from the water ingress problem just the moisture in the atomasphere caused injectors to sieze in the cylinder head so much so that i have seen the bolt holding the injector in removed and the engine started and it would not move the injector. i have also seen the weight of the van hung from the one injector overnight and it not budge.Merc then developed a hydraulic puller to remove siezed injectors and I have seen the injector buckle the hydraulic plate and still not move.
The only answer is a new cylinder head which is very costly when out of warranty. Merc then introduced a working instruction that any removed injectors should be liberally coated with a ceramic grease prior to refitting.
The very least Peugeot and Fiat can do as part of the recall is to remove the injectors, clean up and coat with a similar grease prior to refitment otherwise 3.5 years down the line when the warranty has expired I can see people like us faced with very hefty bills for new heads and injectors just because of a simple injector failure.
Sorry to have gone on so much but I have a lot of first hand experience of this very thing. Believe me it is just like the injectors are welded into the head.
Dont let it go for your own sakes
 
#47 ·
Fiat solution!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

mildew said:
Corrosion or electrolosis between high grade steel and aluminium is a very big factor.
When Mercedes first launched the cdi diesel engine in the sprinter van they suffered the very problem that you refer to.
although they did not suffer from the water ingress problem just the moisture in the atomasphere caused injectors to sieze in the cylinder head so much so that i have seen the bolt holding the injector in removed and the engine started and it would not move the injector. i have also seen the weight of the van hung from the one injector overnight and it not budge.Merc then developed a hydraulic puller to remove siezed injectors and I have seen the injector buckle the hydraulic plate and still not move.
The only answer is a new cylinder head which is very costly when out of warranty. Merc then introduced a working instruction that any removed injectors should be liberally coated with a ceramic grease prior to refitting.
The very least Peugeot and Fiat can do as part of the recall is to remove the injectors, clean up and coat with a similar grease prior to refitment otherwise 3.5 years down the line when the warranty has expired I can see people like us faced with very hefty bills for new heads and injectors just because of a simple injector failure.
Sorry to have gone on so much but I have a lot of first hand experience of this very thing. Believe me it is just like the injectors are welded into the head.
Dont let it go for your own sakes
Thankyou mildew.
I and several others do not want to let this go,Despite what Fiat Peugeot and others may want or say!!!
I know looking at previous recalls that what you say can all to often be true.
Also The companies concerned continued silence tells its own story :roll:
Cheers
 
#48 ·
Re: Fiat solution!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

1happy said:
mildew said:
Corrosion or electrolosis between high grade steel and aluminium is a very big factor.
When Mercedes first launched the cdi diesel engine in the sprinter van they suffered the very problem that you refer to.
although they did not suffer from the water ingress problem just the moisture in the atomasphere caused injectors to sieze in the cylinder head so much so that i have seen the bolt holding the injector in removed and the engine started and it would not move the injector. i have also seen the weight of the van hung from the one injector overnight and it not budge.Merc then developed a hydraulic puller to remove siezed injectors and I have seen the injector buckle the hydraulic plate and still not move.
The only answer is a new cylinder head which is very costly when out of warranty. Merc then introduced a working instruction that any removed injectors should be liberally coated with a ceramic grease prior to refitting.
The very least Peugeot and Fiat can do as part of the recall is to remove the injectors, clean up and coat with a similar grease prior to refitment otherwise 3.5 years down the line when the warranty has expired I can see people like us faced with very hefty bills for new heads and injectors just because of a simple injector failure.
Sorry to have gone on so much but I have a lot of first hand experience of this very thing. Believe me it is just like the injectors are welded into the head.
Dont let it go for your own sakes
Thankyou mildew.
I and several others do not want to let this go,Despite what Fiat Peugeot and others may want or say!!!
I know looking at previous recalls that what you say can all to often be true.
Also The companies concerned continued silence tells its own story :roll:
Cheers[/quo In my talks with Peugeot today it became clear that the Peugeot sales team are as frustrated as we are as there is almost a wall of silence from the technical department who I hope are busy coming up with a fix but just arnt talking to anybody it is also the same with Fiat.If I shout really laudly I get a reaction but than it goes quiet.Peter.
 
#49 ·
Re: Fiat solution!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

SwiftGroup said:
In my talks with Peugeot today it became clear that the Peugeot sales team are as frustrated as we are as there is almost a wall of silence from the technical department who I hope are busy coming up with a fix but just arnt talking to anybody it is also the same with Fiat.If I shout really laudly I get a reaction but than it goes quiet.Peter.
If they aren't talking to you either then we are definitely scr***d
1happy
 
#50 ·
As a very recent member to this sad club, I checked my van at the dealer's. As soon as I looked under the bonnet, all the photos and videos you kind people have posted made sense. However, the dealer had assured me that the French Fiats were of a different design, and I didn't check too closely. :oops:

When I got home, I looked again, and I would swear that the right hand half had moved away from the join in the 200-odd miles back from the dealer. The plastic is very flimsy and bends easily, but there is definitely a gap between the right hand half and the join. My own particular set of photos is :: here ::

I have emailed the dealer, and will see what they have to say in the next day or so, before contacting Fiat directly.

Gerald
 
#51 ·
Fiat

geraldandannie said:
As a very recent member to this sad club, I checked my van at the dealer's. As soon as I looked under the bonnet, all the photos and videos you kind people have posted made sense. However, the dealer had assured me that the French Fiats were of a different design, and I didn't check too closely. :oops:

When I got home, I looked again, and I would swear that the right hand half had moved away from the join in the 200-odd miles back from the dealer. The plastic is very flimsy and bends easily, but there is definitely a gap between the right hand half and the join. My own particular set of photos is :: here ::

I have emailed the dealer, and will see what they have to say in the next day or so, before contacting Fiat directly.

Gerald
Gerald,they are all built in the same factory the only difference with LHD vehicles because of the different wiper set up is that the drain hole is in the centre just right of the joint.For certain Fiat will sort it but in their own time.I bet I am first in the que at the NEC!!!!
 
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